0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
' O" p! O1 d9 I" d3 EWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???
# I, ~7 o' S4 W3 E5 w% [I was so confused.....

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# \: y4 ]6 }% C' H& T, r講到尾都係賺錢
5 n' r8 k! |. J5 Jso銀行可以不斷放款! M* e0 e4 @( b1 F0 d5 S
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
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! ]( w1 l6 _# m: _$ }mortgage loan ; q+ q# ~9 _  [7 W& n. V; R+ @
>conduit
5 U& m+ a8 q4 N9 ~9 G4 S>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
8 O7 K. e. w0 q. J7 A>arranger
: v9 H3 n8 G$ w# ?0 {>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)% l3 f) N" ^, o7 r
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.
# B7 j+ z/ ^7 b% ~* xCDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,& Q+ l) A, ?( [$ A
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.8 ~% E8 }9 P$ R' B- m, W
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,0 ~. n5 Z# Z0 V% j  \# d
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
) x" [1 ]8 M3 r# qAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
) s! V8 i- a  V4 k! csimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,- }- z# {& r/ ]" m3 c- e- A
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest.
3 u! Y: z! q8 A) w! _7 W: weg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
) Y; D  R! t# m; xbanks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.. `3 _5 ]6 G" ?8 k" E; G
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.& j; p) S' c0 p- W* G. \: W
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
- Z+ t8 K0 x: dA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
3 Q+ ~" u2 o% o: B* W8 IThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. ! K3 s2 J" F. @+ n' ~/ t
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.+ O( h2 g3 o. O6 c2 _7 O
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
# {  ^7 o* v! y8 B& U; _Refer to last example,
5 }& R4 z) ?! r& ~' n* e6 A4 Hthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A , y& [( O5 w7 A: U
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand % G# _! [- T/ u% }4 b- j
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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7 Y% o/ w2 {" @% z% k6 V5 ~& j: f/ hA->B->C->D->E+ I9 o/ e# L% E7 V- i" P: `) v
so does it mean if E failed to pay D,
! k) m, D; q/ M) a$ ~all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
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. e% e& ~1 }3 g1 ~1 P: u1 ithe multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
' `; ^3 Q: Q4 Q% B+ F7 I) Fin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
7 t! ?# |$ O4 [; ], kit's the problem of the debt itself.) j' X! i" G" e- m
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif1 y+ U1 v6 |9 i4 u& `
小弟一直都唔明...: c2 G# Q  A( n9 e% V4 W
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全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?, t. }0 a# C! \, _8 L; G; d. b

( D1 S& P0 f. M無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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, s9 ~9 n( L* x, x敬請各師兄解答
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: f% s$ [5 x" R8 aThanks

3 k* _- H; S  [2 t那些根本係 紙上財富  
$ H. o9 z1 U+ s3 J* y% P( E各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic5 f9 `9 W$ L# V& x2 k

0 V3 ~1 _* y4 ~7 J  Xhttp://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產# _8 _6 }3 h. s) j
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高+ E6 E9 O* s6 y
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊7 i$ D% r- Y  w7 `9 C9 I$ ?: t
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦% ]% J% y  t" p' M: V' q" X
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
4 J6 q! C" P, U5 m+ d計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺0 x; z# t6 D% q
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法: B+ m( x2 [# D$ A$ o- F( L# D  b
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
$ I2 z- p- {: m; D4 M' u  o但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
, ]% D) P' f  x) {! L/ V- }9 E例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,   o3 }- d3 i8 e! `/ ~
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
, W0 O8 }( M  g/ \所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁( B+ M" X5 w0 E

0 C2 T. C& A. |+ E你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
7 h9 {* |% A4 r8 B但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
7 V, e2 m* M3 v/ |% L淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
: P( N/ o6 h2 T7 o5 o6 U* i3 _呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
$ m! ~' g, I+ `8 i! F咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif0 O, s& q+ {9 M
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 7 ]7 X8 |1 h9 Z& X/ d1 q6 J
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, 5 V/ w; ]" I  R8 F
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行* |: f& ?/ Q1 t: A5 r! h+ u- `4 o
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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9 g3 \; z) l2 s9 b正係咁樣4 L3 k- e, J7 e! Q9 V3 ]
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業3 Q1 X& U1 l1 R  {3 z' ?$ W
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
: z0 D# |3 F$ q9 ^4 ^/ {& f, I連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
9 k8 f& s$ L- ?) J: O+ \$ F2 z一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
/ _8 }3 m% e8 q編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif  C3 M1 d3 G3 Z" s; z7 F
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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其實係...
3 |" Y, l$ Z; j0 e* o, C* l因為以前未生產, 先消費
2 j* ^0 I& Y" Z1 n! E5 T% X而家就要多生產, 少消費