0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
8 ]* ~; O7 S4 Z1 ~0 I$ eWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???7 N1 j0 V" l: B2 j$ J( R
I was so confused.....

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$ s7 ~. h3 j( |" x; S" w3 c講到尾都係賺錢0 O8 k4 ?3 z+ e2 }  i6 Y% E# V& `& u
so銀行可以不斷放款
5 ~3 S0 q6 n+ [9 A4 n2 c" |/ {美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
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# g* U3 ^/ j) a4 f/ M" e( U( emortgage loan
$ V6 k: d9 H! ^7 f- p. ?5 v4 \" R>conduit
$ f9 M5 j0 R/ A. {>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)4 {  v$ _* m" p* h! x* C
>arranger
$ S" o7 Y! Z6 g: b! V. {# H>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
9 M1 S4 A' ?& [7 n% i2 v) Y' |最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.' I- z3 d8 h8 _; F5 |# R
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
* p% s  y1 _. @* k5 {more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
# ?- x0 \: F; \8 e; F$ Omain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return," C  D; }3 S0 @! Z' f- n
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities./ n6 x3 A2 o4 K* E) O
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.$ O$ `5 [+ r+ s! F/ q% ]3 T
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
! x" q$ b% ?1 O& h& ]normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. 2 b4 P3 s6 \4 D5 I% H* |/ K
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. / X! U. B) `' b% I8 I9 `! k
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party., y& E. h2 S  X& W+ s9 [

. I7 J; h5 S' V2 mim not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.9 c: X( H. S1 V! J3 V  S$ H
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
2 b8 r- R; Y3 L% }& E- wFor eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
$ k; a7 S' M5 PA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.8 N, U5 P7 l; S( D8 _. T" {% r7 g7 r
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
3 {- x! F0 x# i0 f: j7 Q! C1 X. N$ ]9 s; Gbut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
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5 _" i* j( ?4 u4 X6 Y% {" ]! @' _9 c[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif4 Y1 C' x' Y& M6 \
Refer to last example,( o# |+ U1 E  ]2 c: Y
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A $ r0 i1 L- e, P
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand 1 u/ t! n4 Q) x1 Z  j3 C
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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A->B->C->D->E4 O& n# Y4 J9 m8 L7 I2 Y, h
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, 0 p* A. W" b0 _
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?# t% ]9 z( i+ `9 [4 R! g/ z

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% @  O* r- c+ c* H+ N0 g( }, dthe multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
/ f$ b: I7 |! W3 ~in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
  S& ?0 z/ `% Z# J! M4 M6 G3 Git's the problem of the debt itself.4 j1 W& r( {/ M! r
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
* i) ]# G& [1 u' M) U小弟一直都唔明...
4 n1 s$ b0 {$ K! P/ q$ F0 t" q; }5 L; @+ D/ p- J) @# K, ?+ N6 `
全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?
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/ d, X/ z0 }% G5 A: M: ]無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
' @7 C1 i! a# ^" L9 w: X9 _& U# \& ]' F+ |$ {
敬請各師兄解答% u& B0 [; Z/ p, p

* B9 Z$ \+ _3 [& c; IThanks

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那些根本係 紙上財富  . Z2 x# b! p# x) U2 X$ i- |. s
各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic! H8 q* e* d" B' U$ O$ ?% s% L

$ H; q: A6 I1 o3 ^  l- ]http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產, N! Y: Q) O6 w2 y) w1 `
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高" D( b0 G  ?2 }9 k
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊( \$ x, }5 `/ e& ^, m
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
9 z2 p4 Z6 M0 P% R5 R扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,% m: e" ^6 V$ F. Y7 Q% E
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
5 e3 i" z% d: A4 J前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
. b/ N' r0 ~& K7 m9 P4 l7 a同埋個市場既前境要係好先得; K& J# \: B+ B8 w
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
  V" V6 A  W6 x8 |例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, + q" e' R* o4 S3 D7 O3 c0 b
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%4 T2 R5 ^* A' o% v9 F$ g
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁: [5 _; k6 ~$ ]5 R4 o0 M5 M4 y

$ U8 }$ g7 Q* x, i; P# B你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
+ U0 q4 a( C, L: n  k1 @但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
+ h! V1 J! w* `! v淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, : w- C2 m) Q* @
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
$ ^9 C+ r+ e9 s  e) S8 B" z2 n咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif5 f$ z/ {) b% W% Z; J- d8 p- i
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 7 E( y7 v: t0 |+ P! X
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
/ Q1 d1 @6 q* P- _2 R  _; N; t8 |呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行/ I: h" B5 z9 a! p* I' _
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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; {/ A0 r% {" {6 T8 D  e1 D正係咁樣+ u( J) g) _" m- H& t. L
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
& T7 `8 o% m9 |分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
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( o. G) u: B% Z/ C3 g再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,# h0 s, `" y/ p5 i
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票6 C) }) V, K" }3 V# E( U  Z
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產# E6 V" `# H( r7 n' ]
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
( f. B- N/ J0 M4 m5 Q咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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# a) ^5 A' H( l6 l7 I其實係...
/ u0 t& S1 H) B+ L# n) v因為以前未生產, 先消費# f3 {- q. ?& j7 v' t# K6 b* g
而家就要多生產, 少消費