0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
8 U# Z* o% J! T7 w- dWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???
6 l. v# v) a' N& X5 q( TI was so confused.....

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8 y4 M% J0 k( O, y/ q7 w講到尾都係賺錢
* z  l' G. R1 W3 Y" e/ V0 Mso銀行可以不斷放款8 W6 J" c5 X) Z" \! n
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界1 [) i! v% F2 X0 H7 n
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mortgage loan - m2 E% G3 `, G1 Y0 j' F
>conduit
! F; b. l5 N3 l1 T' A>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities): X7 Q7 G1 z$ T1 F7 q
>arranger
1 B  _* b- ]" N' q& N) U- f>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)  d- T: B- u" Z$ G) u0 q8 R
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.. q7 T- W% c" g$ m  g, y' C
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,, f5 |4 u9 n5 J
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
; ^1 G$ x  V8 r9 x  h9 @main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,
1 c; Z4 U( |) q- z6 I  `  }- `in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
8 e: a) `7 ?1 _9 GAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
4 z% E5 ~! Z* D7 i( t" fsimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
# ]: \4 `, _' P( wnormally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest.
1 q$ D9 g/ P& {eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
' L# J6 A  G6 ~* K4 s/ W2 `banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
: C/ B7 X7 t. ~* J0 J, Kin stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
# N# O9 G. R2 G( D5 q# {: V2 l/ |For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,( z/ e! ^5 f( b  d- `: N3 B
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.$ g4 D% Q8 @4 \* d
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
* u: a' H2 M$ `) G9 Ybut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
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2 T- V* ]" I9 b( P' k1 {3 f[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif% Y& ^) U3 F& B* }4 T
Refer to last example,5 G; F% \1 g9 S, x$ m) ]9 P
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A 3 f3 H: _& v  x6 S2 i. q# {
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
9 ]# L* W" \2 u1 z7 X2 P5 ~therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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/ Q( @0 W. L* O& k+ TA->B->C->D->E7 w$ s% I0 _3 D& M& q
so does it mean if E failed to pay D,
% a$ }, ^& U- s9 k$ G1 I" n$ rall the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
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8 B; b4 N% v! m! |: [2 i7 P" W$ ~* y1 x1 H. V) {1 W1 u
the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy, - m; k' R  a$ L; m
in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, 8 ^  z* }( y4 u9 N
it's the problem of the debt itself.
' N" S5 i$ R# \# ^the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
3 h* a) _9 \" }  c  p5 m/ r  R  N. H6 j小弟一直都唔明...
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3 m+ v/ y. t' y8 `全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?' `2 ^7 F- D( I( ~
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無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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敬請各師兄解答$ |1 O: d% T; y6 T2 [1 i2 P

: k* S3 U7 x, L) @- F* cThanks

9 t$ h8 d$ Q* c. q; x
那些根本係 紙上財富  
4 l# [! |$ T4 ^% Q4 Z& m各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic& o  Q  F6 ~: m7 e2 G

8 E* R& b6 D* Ehttp://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
7 i2 w7 T2 [" O7 @+ H9 W) p當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高3 o/ z5 I% l, U3 E; n& O
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
+ k+ N$ i. f- M個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
5 B6 x  G. U& \. j. |6 w扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
6 t5 @! I; K! f計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺2 g6 l$ h# N9 i
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法/ l1 f7 H0 j. ^2 M* b% F) B
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得% B; x* t6 Z+ N0 W+ T# }0 _
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺" W, B' j; c. q# c
例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 8 n) U& ?5 Q  N0 X4 l
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
: q, v( ~) ^! k5 O所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁2 S/ g. Q; g, O9 Y# P. C& b& z& T

( u5 P: i2 l. |你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
& L9 ^) F- B3 {3 n' n但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 0 m) Z% w! u7 e, F' \
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
7 ^5 j& O; C- c$ i呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行5 O' {# H8 a# d& y+ C
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
! e' ~9 V2 c# m, z. o! s唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
( r/ R" d, ^" H7 p7 S* T淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, : c8 r+ s( q! `. Y1 U
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
" {; M+ G! j! @1 t% s5 \' D' R咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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1 |/ H) T! x, x9 L& Q* |正係咁樣
& P. c) A6 Q( O# Z- G" w2 Q其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
2 z0 E( \  y+ K分分鐘佢地唔使還錢6 T, \+ e) H  V; r- Y& W$ D# d

$ P: a4 N. U: T4 J$ \再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
/ v9 e9 l  A6 n* I$ t連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
9 H7 f$ m0 p) z; [9 [! m) O  I一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產+ Q6 I& J; V4 _4 G
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
8 s$ F+ d$ b: b  f, ^+ f咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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% E+ ~" w; u: c) P& c) O4 D, k其實係...$ h0 Z  q0 m8 F- o3 g, R; ~
因為以前未生產, 先消費
" V) b9 t7 y% ^' _+ p8 v& i1 n: u而家就要多生產, 少消費