0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
3 M* g# i8 C& A; b' OWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???# ]/ _* A; ~# D) O
I was so confused.....

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# B# s, C2 J* V) w- w& E4 ~講到尾都係賺錢
/ p. T4 S0 g1 i5 O: {so銀行可以不斷放款0 x4 P0 R* ~/ F, Y1 ^
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界' T; t3 M# f- G" B9 B1 Z9 e# H
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mortgage loan
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>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)( _( N% |, m5 F4 H/ S& q
>arranger
$ a' H0 `" P% x- y* T* f1 K>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
5 O: x- H  W" x8 W2 Y; {% i6 O! T! x最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.
  a5 j8 z; @. e% d8 b+ X; TCDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,  _1 p. ]2 [; {
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
  }& i4 u& `& T4 m: qmain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,6 d' m4 p' ?, S4 t* q
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.: i0 g7 n, _& H+ y) g
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.  n2 t- H* M! ~) k6 r
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,7 W/ Q9 w: b2 W" ^' N9 F
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest.
: L1 h. [  a5 Veg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
5 h2 b5 I7 N  q8 U! u( Z/ T% b* Ubanks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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* i. w! E2 G/ aim not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
- H% B* T+ k7 |8 d% q; h- z9 E! jin stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
# m' h' Z" I$ `5 C5 gFor eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
8 q( p9 c. W/ c* i8 l8 V5 f4 ^A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
% r+ U6 N& \) M2 L3 bThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
' w# w- I5 s, i' tbut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.* Z: ?3 U( j$ t0 \6 x/ D1 _
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif+ v) a* H# o+ Z  a* O4 R3 m
Refer to last example,9 s  `* f. y( F9 z1 h; o4 M; O
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A " {" [! v, _' r" l5 d4 `
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand 7 D$ Q3 E) s0 d7 D$ V3 i/ v
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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# l6 S! h% Z8 O" d! fA->B->C->D->E' N3 |  G8 x, m8 _$ d
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, 5 t% j$ ]# n7 r
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?# c- U' e% y% w! G6 r( s" ^
# z5 E+ D9 w+ Y& S

1 b5 N& T& T1 {2 M" [the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
) C$ {  w, C# E1 ^& i2 ?4 x9 ?in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
- _" R( s' @1 I" w1 {it's the problem of the debt itself.8 j: H, m6 n) q( M. e% _7 Q) @  `
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif" J/ U& j1 f4 f* G
小弟一直都唔明...) @4 f& _- }- _

7 V- I2 Q* x. K7 H6 j) s9 l全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?: q3 g) h4 g; l8 Y4 h3 C

& N. O$ [% U. ~. l2 n4 H: x無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...* W* f& _9 o7 Q
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敬請各師兄解答
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Thanks

9 g  c: |6 t6 f  O# t- I那些根本係 紙上財富  
$ I9 V# v" d/ b各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic; F+ I, |( G5 E' M  M. F! A

$ b) n7 f' D# y# U* nhttp://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產! M5 _9 n2 ?, r% y  ]2 E
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高
. G7 k" z& t8 `% b於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊' _$ {  n6 j% v/ D
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦- R6 v9 ^; F0 V) d5 z/ E" s1 [
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
, d! W1 i9 s% H# }& N* [1 j計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
7 i6 |' K) ?, O2 p4 ^) A前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法0 N6 G9 r' _+ {9 Z% L- {+ j5 b! y
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得( a5 Q0 {9 h! E0 y$ n/ Q0 m; W
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
0 v1 P" D: P6 A$ Q2 k& r例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,
/ X! a3 h' b1 i  O7 ]9 g; |" b咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%7 w% }' m4 {' V9 w3 {4 e5 V
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
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你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
7 ^+ y6 S$ T8 z5 b' f5 }. m( n* `; b但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
6 k: l. W$ c- C* `0 ^# c9 }淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, $ U/ \# `+ V( r( ?
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
8 c! m; _7 `) M咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif' W$ z: M* Q7 O  A( d0 z0 c
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,   \0 I' f# s& N. v. c1 |8 R
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
( R$ X, V: S0 g- Y& S, Z, S呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
  s- k9 G1 Y8 `" M4 h* o1 ~咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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/ Y( z2 f8 E# N0 ^正係咁樣, l0 Y5 `& o: R! T% ~$ S# D1 b' h
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業) I9 s( ]: Q6 }
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢1 ~) v3 v) U6 J
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,4 \+ d& r& ~1 z9 l4 F# ]
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票$ k" R- q' E8 t& h$ X
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產7 h. @: F3 o. V% q
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif" Q( `5 Z% a) q, ]6 Y% J
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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其實係...$ f1 F& o0 x' F% H( x8 q, z( J
因為以前未生產, 先消費- B+ v4 E+ l' r; V6 y
而家就要多生產, 少消費