0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif$ c6 K5 v& J  C
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???. H* L) v0 u, j. A- @% l& Y' L
I was so confused.....

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2 @: B% c1 W/ o8 S講到尾都係賺錢
, _) h- B) U4 I' u- D! b+ Tso銀行可以不斷放款- O" N. V# X  b) }, l4 T5 L
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
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mortgage loan
# o' O+ r9 w+ Z4 I3 {% I7 [>conduit
8 q! B# A' K5 e/ `, [" R, k>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
9 V4 _0 }0 d- L' D% G! a>arranger
: p. L* w; r" O; t( D1 z>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
! K6 q/ |- k! z6 x8 B% @' B6 d最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.
  y' a" q, v( qCDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
+ T9 @6 \' L( `# [more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.0 W  @- ^- {) X' X
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return," n+ K) H+ o4 }0 w, C) M/ h" y& _) a
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.$ Y, B% [9 ^( A' M( m  @5 `0 \9 ]: t
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
. |) u) U5 K/ z# x$ psimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
3 S* T3 M) Q/ ?* R1 _8 Fnormally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. $ J9 m6 l2 F: ~) v5 W
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. ; e6 _# V3 t, Q' \7 `
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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$ U7 U/ F  Z( }' p/ ?6 eim not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.+ Q2 g) D: p' I8 I1 _* G- k
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
( `/ R9 P1 E) m+ \9 BFor eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,# y( q) N& y& A# `! D) j! i% G
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
+ z3 m- s6 d. n: s! s! U6 iThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. $ }( M& P. p3 T/ w
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
0 ?$ D8 }; F  K' ^! P* p7 ^( JRefer to last example,
, k- i  B0 v7 l8 u9 Mthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A 9 |' h. E! [- B: m& i5 P/ D5 v3 L
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
( U' X  j& m5 }* `2 ntherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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6 X2 d7 n& x+ i! {- L8 P# kA->B->C->D->E
1 [  i: A6 J0 c3 Z3 l7 Aso does it mean if E failed to pay D, 1 y9 r9 w+ t8 G# s
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?( ~) T# `1 d( T% S' ~

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  Q6 y& q( ^$ |the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
9 A1 ^0 ^2 V+ g' b7 @8 H' @9 Z+ rin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, 0 `- t$ z# q: Y6 L7 h1 z3 I3 v: b: Z
it's the problem of the debt itself.
! D( [  Y, A3 b* Othe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif0 [; ^5 `0 z9 Q( `# W; y7 y
小弟一直都唔明...& w# W; p0 Q! t8 c& x
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全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?0 i" X4 [4 ?- N0 z% x5 g
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無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛.... n# ~2 Y- x) R1 I* x& o( e7 a
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敬請各師兄解答/ ~5 G8 s+ L! |1 u. p+ t

  D- L$ Q! d4 a7 h0 uThanks

7 e5 u5 w3 t. q( q那些根本係 紙上財富  
( s+ [5 \: ^; P5 T2 N9 d- Q+ E各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
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http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
# Z* k" S4 A! _9 o2 s7 u6 Q當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高
. C6 h! {8 |. y/ `; Z於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
  Z8 F; n+ Y2 Y+ r' q% H個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦. X8 |2 [6 \5 G
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,5 L5 j5 S6 |8 g8 m$ i2 w
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺8 q+ T( _2 ^% m: _2 s. q
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法, d0 o$ }% ?4 m" \7 \8 w
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得7 m4 h. @" X: _0 ]% z# ?1 |7 S0 l6 d
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
5 w. L5 w0 d4 @0 s/ ]9 f5 _例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,
) @4 I9 E3 B; I6 ~2 i; t咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
9 _5 v) {( ?( B# m. p, {所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
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6 m) c2 J" e3 ^. f6 n你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,   n* U4 G. T, q6 P' W
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
  L( l8 ?& X2 v; w& w淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
4 ]( `* J- l' x& G2 h9 g* D呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行: K) c3 g! `) Q8 D
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
8 z- P/ I1 @, s/ x, }" p唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 9 |; @) ~+ k% M/ }4 U
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, % [; q6 q; u! ?3 K2 l' |
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
$ x' Q4 d/ R6 [! {4 P咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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正係咁樣4 L9 f# m6 u$ o2 ]7 Z! N0 q# V
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
/ W' T0 @1 L- T# ?/ _3 y- j' s5 e. J. X分分鐘佢地唔使還錢6 b2 o# W: T$ P+ y1 g
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,3 F) S* [  x, K( ~1 s4 k
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
& t7 K' p& k' m( A) I4 O5 ~一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產4 I& L! P& H: k  j, |
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
, f' ~  F  o( |$ d: k咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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其實係...2 i# K3 ^8 g4 z3 ?0 f6 ~
因為以前未生產, 先消費0 A$ Y/ ]# I5 A' T
而家就要多生產, 少消費