0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif6 s! y9 n4 ?$ s- I6 P3 m( F" Q
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???
& Q( ~2 I# G, p* hI was so confused.....

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講到尾都係賺錢
, `% v0 k& B% ~- _/ \. Nso銀行可以不斷放款0 l, C7 T3 H4 r; w, T! W% A
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界' J+ G7 m. J: K

: @8 W: ?" h( w* h5 c- ]mortgage loan " D6 R9 m$ f1 R5 I  S
>conduit
+ ]' N; e/ }2 X# q- ?>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities). Q$ Q$ [6 s: l8 Z
>arranger
& X; Y, h# U1 D' m& d/ e+ X: \>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)" ]3 }0 p3 e& {; {3 ^8 x' ^# y* q
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.+ S7 |8 Q) _* x: M9 b4 E$ v0 s; q
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
5 m6 t6 Q# z! Z6 `# J! `more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
, W; \2 g% |4 L# M, J0 L- s' B* nmain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,9 f% t; Y( w) u$ C4 g4 M2 N; @
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.. H+ P: {# B6 v& i4 C6 J
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.7 Q; i$ n+ u" [  Z1 C
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,- l+ D1 E% ]) c
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. % C5 l8 V7 C  I0 W
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
! h% h' s  _& A/ R8 i$ \banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.; W, |( t0 v+ O' T) y2 ]: e
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.: x' w  D9 ^8 a/ Q5 A, K/ f
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,$ c( z& t) X. I/ F2 ^" E* v
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
7 K9 F  [" u) f& F5 DThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. # u& U7 v& p  r. h
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.% O8 M! y4 R. @6 W
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif  R+ ?0 b. }9 I6 a: w1 U! X& b
Refer to last example,( o: v6 P$ _  U2 q" v4 o
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
  u+ P) @$ n' U0 V; RBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
8 b. x  D" C4 \9 J/ z/ y: e3 |* jtherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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+ S2 `: N+ p4 F$ \8 w" FA->B->C->D->E- ]9 R1 J9 I, }/ J# |6 W
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, 6 Y- Q1 ^; b  s( L, ^
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
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the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
. V" e1 P6 |* L  b6 Kin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, 9 t% ?; B8 r8 }( M
it's the problem of the debt itself.
' g, I" g" T  h, Z: Q4 V; kthe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif8 J$ I2 C/ E+ p1 o4 b1 d6 C
小弟一直都唔明...
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全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?. Y( A3 K/ }/ p) x  E
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無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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) ~& z6 {3 A' T( H4 ]" ?敬請各師兄解答
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Thanks

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那些根本係 紙上財富  9 W( X  u. M+ k3 s. y9 ^
各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
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http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產. M0 G2 M7 M  I4 ?: K
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高
+ }1 G" z1 T! B7 J, T於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
. O  _" S; |* o個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
: b0 [6 ^" k" {) B2 \4 G3 d  x* M扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,5 [) _8 d* u8 w6 L9 x# q: r+ ^) n
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
! O4 _6 q( i+ O8 A% N* C  [' l6 w) @前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法4 ^5 d7 N6 }  e3 u+ Q6 l1 `/ B3 Y) }
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
9 G$ e2 w5 Q; @/ @  T4 o但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
  @* q. o  i* [9 H例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, ' A" M) d1 V8 D3 |( f6 r4 f
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
  E) z3 v; O* `所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
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! J3 _. V3 Y% i" {$ j- [- d: e2 b你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, . P) f2 M1 m/ K9 a- d
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, # V/ b, ^# ~3 ]0 m7 `' V1 h: `  d2 v1 X
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
# ]7 n5 s' x& d呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行5 b8 m4 ~) S4 f4 d' _& w, Y+ w& P
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
1 @) M7 s. k- b8 B: P# u) t唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 8 k' v* X# |2 A8 E4 I9 `0 X
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ; o+ x5 o+ ~' f  D
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
8 G9 }$ x/ v/ b* r4 l咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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$ @4 _) [; [, [  ~正係咁樣, b: m5 p# W& Q; n/ _
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
( c7 }9 V: v+ f' U- X分分鐘佢地唔使還錢. q1 n2 b, M# ~+ D9 u# H
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
; T: f0 u" n4 F" h. P連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票- _% s+ @/ t, H$ @8 }. d' @3 T8 H3 P
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產' a+ S5 E3 A- V' T) v4 d1 O
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
1 ^' t4 W- k! g5 ?* E3 w2 _咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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其實係...8 j+ n& X; W* E4 [3 ]
因為以前未生產, 先消費
% k0 F, n8 v$ S* y, @" D& a而家就要多生產, 少消費