0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
; F& D; Y: W( S, [Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???
6 j, z& @% l( O0 [1 C; tI was so confused.....

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# D4 Z7 Y. d2 i講到尾都係賺錢
+ a; {. a3 {; d" D- H1 \so銀行可以不斷放款( ^  B4 f* H3 _0 o! R1 E7 N1 m
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界0 w% `) _- u; B+ L. F4 W
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mortgage loan
, t% o9 s5 N2 G( j>conduit6 V; o/ l8 U# M+ ?6 Z1 a
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)! Z% _* M3 R: x3 o
>arranger6 b/ K: N8 V% V- L/ C3 M* @
>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
9 _+ H$ B3 F3 ?/ L* `% ~% D5 p& D) l最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.6 a, |7 L, x& j- Y! ~" m  v! S
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
& G1 Y# U; p# o1 _* K4 Xmore risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
8 S# ]6 u: G# O/ K2 z1 Tmain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,
) e* ?0 Q5 C+ E- g  T, Q; lin other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
; g; ~! X0 n* j. k! C& }, VAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.5 U; \2 {# d! ]3 t3 f# x
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
5 c$ d9 w( u+ l( n2 z, {9 Lnormally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest.
4 ]7 Z. c4 [! @. N' u* f7 Ueg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. + s* g+ P5 M7 ~3 Q# b- {  ^& R
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.6 J+ q$ g% y) Q- e; }" [* s8 |2 W
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
& Q: [, X; Q0 v- k$ K3 kin stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
' e+ v' Q3 D) [' S6 VFor eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
5 ~2 G. F! d, u4 H/ R  hA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.$ F7 \+ S  w3 e& g6 E* z. G1 c
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. , f8 `4 O1 @2 q( j$ r7 x
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.$ a1 g( n0 @9 X4 ~3 _6 R* I# Y4 d
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
; p% T6 Y1 t7 t' C+ q( D3 @- zRefer to last example,
/ W" D& w; P" ~4 {# I7 s8 Vthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
6 N, P$ W& @5 d' A- o  l6 UBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
+ L: b. l0 O$ V) c9 Ttherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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A->B->C->D->E
8 J, n6 {  S4 R) _9 Q! T( eso does it mean if E failed to pay D, 8 j- X: l) V7 O
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?) n- G& ^( {0 R0 k( _$ `- R2 v

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the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
  \. s+ J( B/ g: cin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
+ J& B7 f+ S/ }0 {' Ait's the problem of the debt itself.
0 \3 z: L! q/ @$ A. m. w9 R: dthe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
% x/ U& O. j, [& G% B& d4 E小弟一直都唔明...5 K0 U  E+ Y1 \; S
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全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?0 u6 }, t/ Q$ |. ^

8 E3 K, }9 Y) H+ W' H無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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敬請各師兄解答
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Thanks

, Z2 U. {% s/ P& L8 ]那些根本係 紙上財富  
( ?* W" Z- I: |3 R" t* Z各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic( @& V$ _: K" _% b; O3 [  m

4 J! ], J# ?8 w$ Rhttp://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
4 K( ]2 v) z$ S2 O9 K# t, d4 x當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高; c2 S! l% ^$ B
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊' s% Z7 K9 U/ ]2 r; q" Q1 H' Q% y
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦  t6 C+ o, ?( w
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
0 f) H1 Z. O3 Y0 r計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺/ E5 X% e+ k' U; f3 R5 d! {+ G
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
6 q9 E1 d" c& u, ?. C+ C2 Z% g8 C同埋個市場既前境要係好先得( `1 J3 G2 Q3 {1 }$ {
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
' L2 B+ A9 b+ L' p4 [# |例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,
$ @+ j9 @& z. z( t5 i咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%" E& M# K5 w' M% s/ Q5 i$ s/ q
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
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你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, : R; ]/ U) Z8 o+ h+ C! `
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 1 h1 I) a7 {7 K3 M
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, * R! ?( R; d4 I! n# \
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行/ \) v) i3 t: E# s( ]
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
; ~; X+ ^8 @: ^& `4 b5 |. o唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
# p: \- a3 O& d; L淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
) O+ \# l, C6 q3 M呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行, m* l/ l+ p1 r+ Y; Q
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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* D- |) J1 A" ]5 x) C( O正係咁樣- G" Q. e& g7 \% T
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業* L9 W; d! Z0 c) ~& ^+ m3 o- c" V3 s
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
6 m. n- K5 O& @" \$ W' O連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票; m/ o( E4 g9 n0 U/ d
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產8 A- c9 s1 e: A! k4 w- Y
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif6 g; o2 `$ z* K
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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- y: B1 f3 x! l: }& b2 O% a其實係...
( W: n7 Q( f3 ]: H; h因為以前未生產, 先消費
4 @& P( D7 T  l" X; U$ `+ p而家就要多生產, 少消費