0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
6 v$ T9 ~# Y* u. l% `* {Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???# U" c9 {! D7 N
I was so confused.....

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講到尾都係賺錢: N0 m7 b6 O3 D! v4 s6 q& L
so銀行可以不斷放款& C3 X* a8 o5 H( c+ b+ e
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界/ a$ ^; W) z0 r3 Q0 Y5 T' D& u

( {/ Z% Y( s* j! X! C  Vmortgage loan ' ?3 ?2 w8 k" ~5 C3 i! h2 [
>conduit
/ ^; N6 `) @5 t- m+ |; [0 s. b>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
  I  X5 l6 a2 \( G>arranger
% h8 T( R. b9 A. Z. x! _) \* O7 j# W( U>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
# G7 H5 x% L1 V  D" p3 H- S: w最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.: n# O$ F& N8 y. F0 t
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,+ D# K) j2 z# G5 A. A
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.. P' U, V* q, ^* u& ^3 j# A/ e
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,  n6 C+ f9 ]; c: H2 P+ \
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.2 R: N+ D" ~1 J% r
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
/ z! A9 p7 E; {7 t2 S7 X6 Msimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
/ F: h: B1 r; N0 r2 Vnormally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest.
  G: n7 y  m1 r$ B$ Beg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. 5 P) o% T4 B! z7 X# U
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.& Q$ ]( x. ^3 T5 W# @" j

9 {/ V7 H/ V& W' t* R" A5 g6 |im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
: X- o9 Q/ q; ]8 ?8 G% vin stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.+ \2 i1 V) m7 r+ i% M
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
6 `) C. X9 ]" M$ XA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
- g& K4 u- l  c; X9 Z( aThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.   W. R' k+ P  |% Z3 k
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
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2 o" A' N7 Z5 w# z2 k5 Y[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif& ^. V, S" Y0 j* V/ i1 U. f# J
Refer to last example,; A. K2 L4 `2 V' `# q. o8 T
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A   e% O( x9 c% o
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand % q5 F+ ?) d9 K+ c  y- [
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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  P' J4 b7 \3 m9 S# D3 o5 l! e- E1 KA->B->C->D->E
5 U9 }4 r) V4 m' P7 k) Eso does it mean if E failed to pay D, 1 f' Y8 y  T) [4 r. n
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
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+ w- h- z+ @  p& j& n. ?2 cthe multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
7 \* @$ k7 p8 ^) X; I8 Rin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
% g, v. U: U/ vit's the problem of the debt itself., D: y* M$ x7 c' \1 g
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
( J0 y% |) J7 R/ p: d* r& n小弟一直都唔明...7 n; g: f0 L: ^1 u8 e
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全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?
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. ^/ F6 ~9 M# G" S, |( G4 [無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...  B( P- w) q3 d6 e( d3 g
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敬請各師兄解答
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+ @4 }& ]) v# ^- @Thanks

5 i& v1 `2 l" M4 n$ z那些根本係 紙上財富  
0 l) g8 e, P3 `. n9 }  p4 W各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
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http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產& i) J' i7 G* @1 k7 X9 _+ H
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高0 J. z) W1 N# J  S/ |0 v* u( A
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
+ G) C$ y) N  A個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
9 H1 k% |" R/ ]( m2 e扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,  s6 D! Z, {$ f% ]$ i; `5 {
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺- f. N$ K0 W  |( |# g* W
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法) b  a0 q6 V  W8 N/ `6 p! \
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
: b+ z8 M  n9 a: T但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
7 U4 D: v5 Y' b* P% Y' A3 L例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 6 b5 x! P5 ]$ ~) [/ q
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%! S6 J9 h, y4 }8 m! C6 p; L
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁4 U. n, o# L' U) y1 J

+ v5 J" H- |. U1 s  O) j2 D7 O你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
& L9 e+ ]9 |+ c/ T9 ^但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
) j9 E2 ]$ D+ g淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ( ]& j- F* m, p9 \; {( E6 x" g
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
" F( L+ w6 R, d2 u咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
$ l) C5 q1 R, I4 m- \4 x: N4 q唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
, x% i( N- b; |淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, 2 Z5 g6 Z  a( H1 g9 C  b, S
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
! Q9 [" o2 r' c; F+ x! A4 G' q( \咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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正係咁樣
7 `: i( @' @( M2 s" s9 Y其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
: w, h5 \+ O. p( P分分鐘佢地唔使還錢$ H% r1 a' b; \+ W  O. B& e
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,# M& z9 L6 u8 N$ D  Y
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票! U4 a- c; s8 C2 z! o7 `: \0 U6 M3 K
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
* a/ O7 e9 {( a7 Q編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
3 T' {" x$ Z- `4 M! M, Q- d咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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, U- k1 G' _  T% u: W: _其實係...
3 ?9 B4 n) q) b# D4 O* {因為以前未生產, 先消費* M. @+ R, T' B
而家就要多生產, 少消費