0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif& {/ z0 X8 p# T+ g
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???* l" e* M+ Q; j/ R5 |
I was so confused.....

$ I9 Q) l: H$ C7 P
, e4 @! [3 O- ~- z# H講到尾都係賺錢; b: @* p# ?" N; h/ x2 j' f: p
so銀行可以不斷放款3 Y" u# R  Q6 {% n; t9 n
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界8 w" B/ e# p) @7 K  w
  t3 {6 A( ?0 k8 [) W
mortgage loan ) c7 n/ }. C% e- ^* T5 o6 o
>conduit5 @- S* Z% ~9 `* I- F8 ]
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
4 k8 Y/ @9 E+ u: N( [7 g>arranger" h1 Z" ^6 z" `8 t& |) Z6 \+ B
>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation): O' v' l# V0 m
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.# H" w" C' p- r" E
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,8 F# l8 q) K$ o1 j
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment." G) y! m6 F% A8 F/ {
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,* U0 k) K$ Z7 V+ ~3 l3 c  A
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
  @* O; f8 Y/ Q8 u0 pAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
. G2 [& l4 ?7 U/ bsimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,' x' ~8 c: M! ]9 G2 g( A
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. ! n- x0 H3 }3 o0 }" m" T5 n
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
3 L/ O" P  \/ o- G# f8 O- Rbanks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
, p) z7 l3 Z/ }* S6 o) U. _, D1 c# D( ~, z
im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
0 ?( @# [/ ~0 }6 J, f8 [in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.  g9 c& I1 v" X. f- q2 b
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
+ P( p+ {" f: U$ b( L& WA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.1 K# S% d: `% j$ K% l( \* \
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
! I) ?4 {& @" Abut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
0 e$ }: C% I) I/ [- \5 n4 h
* V& {: K& L2 [3 }  d7 `[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif' ~8 y+ B: m) D! u* P& T- |, p( D
Refer to last example,) t5 Y9 j3 `8 q5 I4 ~/ ^7 q
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A $ D7 x! `4 `+ P! ~/ M6 y0 g4 Y
Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
5 H8 f) O3 Z+ @8 S/ b& l. w; ttherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

! l& R- n  i. @9 ?' h! J5 n

, e* e" M2 N  G) }) B$ W& ~3 ?9 E0 b0 d' l6 v0 f
A->B->C->D->E/ i2 G, E# B. o
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, 1 ?, q* r* E. B8 N
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?  p: Y) z$ a6 U7 I0 ^
' `4 r5 ^5 L7 {& h
' }- p) q: p8 x; l  u5 C1 I
the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy, 3 E# v5 u* C) E
in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, 3 T" z9 h: n' J
it's the problem of the debt itself.  N7 B4 v9 r: q7 [
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif5 ~5 _! }' Z2 j( j+ L* I
小弟一直都唔明...1 D* C# ~: B1 h9 E6 E
, J& I7 L! k- b
全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?: {5 l  ?' C5 _

; ~! f# B5 z' ~3 p( d) [無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
1 k' \0 ^( s0 k4 g. v( g3 j+ [3 m! Z- c
敬請各師兄解答
  c( P/ V3 i8 z0 h( X2 S
* `7 G/ j' n" rThanks

0 q# _% y1 `! \那些根本係 紙上財富  
: R$ @: U" y8 a, ~$ P1 A5 s# m各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
0 \# Q8 B7 W6 l' ~( m" |, F8 `: O5 E+ T
http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產/ F6 U( B- u% k* [/ g1 T  n, X
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高
+ p3 K5 P9 k$ U& ?+ q4 z8 m於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊0 w: f8 l( O; H/ u8 F& t
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
+ J0 A$ H: \% Y, U+ I' {) Y: U; C6 @扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,. }% k! j  `5 h0 E! e& z
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺0 X) o# u5 w0 A0 R" R& c: {
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
1 `! T7 v) w; ~5 h5 P同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
; A& l  w& u  g$ F) t" n9 `但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺9 |% `0 s! u* e2 c$ Q! N
例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,
2 G  ]* e' T3 o  Q. ^咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
- R3 c5 j5 Z% Z所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁. B6 }+ b) B+ J) S

1 i0 j: y: s" e& R你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, 7 ^+ W/ H' f" \; B
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
, N( e* s' W6 v; v1 g* w淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
$ ?! T2 `, b6 @2 Y3 m0 r: e# U呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
3 [* l$ @0 D! m# V# @" S0 O咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif( y) E/ `) R+ E9 q
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
; x0 j8 @. F* t. b0 n% L" }  \淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
" J, M* [0 @, i1 l* |5 k呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行' @1 a7 \+ Q5 }1 ~
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

$ x' A; w& V8 q* V. c8 n" p3 P; l" `6 T( X- k2 r
正係咁樣
" _$ t3 o; |5 w$ F2 w其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業* v6 f) b' @6 l+ J
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢2 G) Z. C/ f. l' n( J$ L! J
& p. J6 i: j2 `, x
再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
7 M! N" G3 B0 n/ S連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票  X& b$ s# x3 D; c' b0 s/ @
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
, h! G& b. b: F, W) a編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif1 Y- S5 c2 l4 z8 O6 `
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

9 B, P% m& P# X; e
+ o6 L. x! m2 B& \5 }
其實係...# f) y/ }' D2 x" }, h
因為以前未生產, 先消費
$ w, B6 u6 J' Q而家就要多生產, 少消費