0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif* d( ^8 a8 Q4 s! J7 y6 Q) K
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???  s- X8 C7 B  ?! H
I was so confused.....

' H% v2 d& i: V1 P0 Y0 t! D, y3 d; j& d' ^' x
講到尾都係賺錢
  r) U, R& n0 y6 Rso銀行可以不斷放款6 H0 Q" }+ q) l  |% s8 P- ]% |% i
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
! @5 M/ ]4 X- ~
8 F6 x1 \+ ]9 c7 W! F* Jmortgage loan 9 V8 J. i* K& _( }: ~% `
>conduit& n$ Q8 A; Q3 {9 E9 [; M
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)7 m" C; y7 M  |( o  Y( x
>arranger
& I' F: |1 s$ A' t8 J>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)! Q. X9 o' b1 e- o6 E* l  P, x7 \4 t
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.% y- _, o! b3 C  i# W; c' j
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
# i6 d( g8 r1 }more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.5 t$ [% ]+ M" r* ?- C& g. e
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,
% A. y$ A  X5 [$ x( L, E/ {5 bin other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
7 W3 C- U" _: M. _9 W( X$ c5 iAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.1 P& w* Z2 R: b8 X5 E" Z( d
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,, o- F! M' T6 j" f7 P* v
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. 6 R) x. G' g# Y. K6 A4 b; S
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
' F& }" R" A& w& ibanks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
2 H& z) q+ E+ x& n( d& {! x. e$ S1 w% A( Z- v# n# h5 H% J/ f
im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.
7 e' x! [# Q! Z) jin stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.  L5 `' o9 y, m3 o1 g+ O7 S
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
2 u9 p# {5 d. R0 qA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
7 F! Z; |: F$ hThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. & m( Z7 V5 e7 y/ @% c
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.2 Z1 z+ _3 o2 O7 [# O/ _+ ]' x" ]
/ t# E4 S. v$ a# {, M- J5 f( k# E# v& P
[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif+ T- h$ s! C/ [8 l# H- S+ k
Refer to last example,
9 E8 W3 E7 H4 L1 X2 I& r8 B  xthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
: F2 v6 Y6 c+ k, p1 Y' E# bBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand $ N8 W7 h" O9 }, V! d
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

* d7 w2 d4 t, X* o9 R8 F' ~5 y) @$ H: `' `; I* [. e1 l' y

3 D8 o% d& K$ R& G& z( wA->B->C->D->E
6 Z) v* P+ u; s$ [: i! d/ }) J0 Cso does it mean if E failed to pay D,
" j( F0 O/ x: w; C/ ]all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
9 [% a9 q0 f  y3 M7 @# |1 N/ c% v9 ^3 v1 e. N" c( |& I2 E; L! N
8 J* r* w7 z/ B# n7 d7 q
the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy, - M% a/ i; V* g$ B8 \
in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, 9 v' h7 u% s& z, h  ]" w; ?( ~
it's the problem of the debt itself.
% g8 h% M% V! n  K% k$ V5 Cthe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif+ E  ?1 _' e4 ]1 V( Y( v
小弟一直都唔明...
/ d: R% d& `5 s" y( L7 n6 V- X  t( q! j
全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?' X& q& V+ z4 Y9 b# [& ]2 t$ @
1 h- E% i& n; {2 E" s/ C. a
無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
: v5 r0 ~0 D, T9 T7 h+ b4 ]  u3 H0 E  C5 a2 s
敬請各師兄解答. z: U3 B1 S5 _* A6 [! a

7 N$ [% m8 H; w5 P+ t$ [6 GThanks

+ z; X, ?5 y6 g6 \5 J. I" j
那些根本係 紙上財富  
3 c. |' G4 X2 |各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
3 ]0 A$ ?. T) r6 @' @9 b$ G- F3 x2 ~1 o, M
http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
$ P9 x9 Q' R, P+ Y當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高" I" m7 _( C# ~9 E- ~8 J
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊; e) h8 k2 ]7 y0 h
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦4 i' A8 N; V" \1 @! N0 D7 {
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
2 U, P3 ?. ~- O! s# x) Y8 h- o0 a+ Z計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
+ r1 B. q- q% j: ?' w前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法6 b- L( s1 I" J8 P, Z
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得* \0 G0 Z$ `5 R2 L5 n0 J& O
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
) T  c4 P+ [$ ?- q" f例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊,
" H% e5 _2 j1 q/ b2 O1 N咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%9 W& {! A# y! H8 R* z8 O
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
  s: H- r8 @9 v. P: S" x7 U4 z+ g0 X, c( A. C! }
你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, . h3 e! l( y. }' z8 V; T. F
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
/ _/ J% ~7 m6 z& Q/ |1 E淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
% @8 g) ~4 a5 j2 e) X3 Y呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行% n0 H7 e( z0 O5 b7 t% E' k
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif, O0 K# V; p+ d( e
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 0 ?( x7 ]4 }* H7 W$ y
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
1 c2 N* p! h) P9 w1 j3 y, B% n呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
  G* a4 i; ~0 u  R9 G咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

$ V' v! m8 d2 z4 X

% z. z1 Q) P0 e5 [1 J正係咁樣
5 r) O# [  ~& U% k# u其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
+ X( x: l- r2 c* J/ G分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
5 x* y! }( @# O' p5 {: B* _( ~! _5 H; w# |; H
再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,$ r0 s6 s2 \9 @/ M% S. k7 }  p: z
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
' `" A! F0 G+ T5 [一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
$ G3 }" M1 h( y* `5 D9 T編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif' g- G2 |: {. s: ]) X4 Q0 Q* j! C. T: ^4 u
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

8 c6 @3 d5 \4 C  ]! b
- z* \# T! t# u1 B) V- d" x其實係...
8 g/ C; a: O. Y% U$ U& @1 j2 ?因為以前未生產, 先消費# g8 g- h1 z2 p5 ?- e' n- D
而家就要多生產, 少消費