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原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
4 J8 k5 z! W7 D2 BWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???
: l$ w9 K; Z7 Y! o. A8 K1 ?, }4 oI was so confused.....
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講到尾都係賺錢( O# Z& I% ?7 n; B
so銀行可以不斷放款8 k$ \2 ]( A4 |0 j0 Z
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界9 L: S; m3 B# h% P2 ?5 v% p

0 m. x, C) t6 A! z" o" k; k9 gmortgage loan * D9 j3 Y( c6 S% m. W5 a6 b
>conduit. z, O# m1 O  \5 V( z5 D+ e
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
' H6 O$ e* y) p6 B>arranger
$ |7 W. ?* x5 c. X$ V>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
$ y: E6 X$ `& K( M: G6 ?最後去到投資者
i thought it is the reason of rate of return.9 S! M/ R$ Q2 r, W( g2 a) {0 l- Q
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,
, _: [* ~; i# q6 Z0 n) lmore risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.$ c( q  s' o& f' y' F
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,
+ g2 L+ g! d/ }8 tin other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
5 \' G7 r( z& qAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.$ o$ S8 n* }0 @* _  x. w5 t
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,# }3 U. o8 ~5 ?0 C- q
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. 3 q) Z: E4 v7 c4 j( I
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. 3 ^- X0 a9 p  A4 A' Z* ^! C
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.  M! X" o% e# g  F: k% C9 z; g
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.2 d) i( e; a8 X" D3 W) Q
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.3 N& U4 `# Y0 F7 o+ k: s* `
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,  c) I6 W. B, h
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.5 r3 s5 z, E7 @7 ]9 G! M- N
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
$ `: v( o3 X% \- X7 l( n7 U, C% Tbut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.& N1 _9 T) J+ A. ~* \5 p. u3 ?
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]
原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
& o: V" L, C& x6 p7 Y. `Refer to last example,
+ C% A( u8 {# v3 t1 j- P+ Vthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
. g& }8 h1 w, `Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
1 S' m2 Z& s- n* Y' T. b( m, [6 itherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...
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! k% f; Q# w( _) o8 FA->B->C->D->E5 }6 E& A  ?, W$ o* T
so does it mean if E failed to pay D,
  o' ~" f, Q) z$ Fall the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?- S. h  h8 G- A" Z6 Q' ?

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the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
3 j  j3 u: `! R0 Hin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
9 M+ F" c" U" U) U# Yit's the problem of the debt itself.9 J: S' }4 a- w: I
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.
原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif; j* z  X  V+ x. [4 S# H! J
小弟一直都唔明...
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全世界都蝕錢,咁邊個賺緊錢呢?( b$ ?7 {$ L* u4 |8 A9 Y1 v
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無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...1 O1 [( X5 f, t  l

$ T7 S( d' p! t; Y1 X9 _7 ?* `敬請各師兄解答
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6 I2 }1 Q: y6 G$ v* P& w7 |& P. Z! eThanks
6 E& H! Y+ u# a# D* a% Y( R" r9 \那些根本係 紙上財富  
7 `5 R7 S# E8 i8 L3 R各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在
with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic8 |) H/ R! t/ h7 x1 E. R& ~

# K+ F* I( B9 |http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif
其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
$ x! j, h  A! K) f# A0 ~當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高- M% T  m5 t( Q' ?" y
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊+ h8 _% p5 ^. ]/ ~
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
3 U2 F5 H% K, i: U, i$ u0 j* J5 E9 o" X  R扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
& y; I6 Q# {( |- @計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺+ J' X: J. M9 i/ j9 ^' p+ b
前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
" H1 ~; a. D' L4 G8 `. h7 H同埋個市場既前境要係好先得/ O6 [; F- z; I
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
1 J1 c3 l& `1 f8 B& W. e4 y例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 7 n; ^1 z: z. j6 i, F* F" Q+ T
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%) G: g3 U5 {, b- a4 T4 H# U  S
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁$ A  r4 A  R1 U7 i4 w1 y' K
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你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
/ }5 r3 A* v/ Q5 b  `8 G6 n但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 1 F9 ^  S+ c' O  ]3 p( f
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ) u% o4 G. ?( q+ [1 S
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
3 n# @1 s3 k* x4 Y- J+ I  o咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?
原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif  Z- n/ \. l$ r% s" [7 g
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, ; q. F; ^. @7 i; V) y
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, * ~" u8 [9 n  a- o$ b
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行1 H' V/ D# S" p; M* m* G* j9 ?& a
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...
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  l1 N9 A2 B' j. t* c/ r正係咁樣' n! Y8 v9 h7 s0 w9 P1 D
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
/ i8 F& Z, @0 e- M8 j* P分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
" P' k# {% F) @7 X9 }& |) D0 [) ^連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
3 ~+ l2 ^/ Q- H# u2 x  M一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
0 ?/ c0 c7 y9 m' C編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
( N; `9 |" R8 j' ~) D& H+ x8 v咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
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其實係...
: |; v2 S1 s  H1 J因為以前未生產, 先消費- k1 b% n$ t* h7 |# m2 X. _: x
而家就要多生產, 少消費
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