0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif% X4 p% L6 l7 _$ Q2 B7 L
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???
  b1 B. z6 u- A5 S; e* OI was so confused.....

  _! b. E2 Y; q5 E7 m
& P& _$ f6 Y4 c! {% O0 \9 T- U
講到尾都係賺錢
0 C. K! V$ U" |8 w% `! gso銀行可以不斷放款# e0 F, g5 B7 I. v
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界- i, f9 Y% E, J: Q5 c# e& O
# l: y) x& U& b9 S
mortgage loan
; e( T! A' J0 d  v6 \7 {>conduit+ C6 U% ^7 Y" p1 ?9 d
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
; A$ r: o! D) O2 K& H3 f) X>arranger9 q& _6 j0 h# V5 K4 B- P" h/ y3 V' u
>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
4 j* z9 v% \9 w/ n; I' Z9 [最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return./ W- t7 X2 N5 r8 J/ ^
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,% C; E6 \4 O6 Z8 s4 u3 i% Y7 u
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.7 x8 \3 @7 a; v4 Y! J% s# X$ _
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,$ `4 G! R4 t  `4 X; X) e
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
4 ?. |- w7 X2 V# a2 v% F) ~Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
' E. o( F# Y1 }2 G6 [similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
; t2 U. r/ O7 I& {! I! Knormally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. ( O& ^# ~( {7 t% A' q
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.
- X/ t: `- V+ J8 A/ \' @- P( ?banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
1 f# H6 R2 ^7 G( F- j
: a$ p6 G2 |; J  e: Y8 x. vim not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.* |6 P/ z& _0 a
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.& s; ?: u7 T) o& ]! e% R0 G
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,# {0 e: o5 a" r3 n+ B1 i
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.( w2 y8 ?3 }4 F2 n" J2 E
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. ( A& o) C% {8 s$ Z% B' F
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.0 \  @# i$ o+ @. L8 R" S

- D8 H' _) }% G1 s1 S2 Q+ I[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
) O5 |! [% f( O0 E- Z' J$ p$ gRefer to last example,8 r8 a9 ~& J& s0 W5 y5 X3 K" @
that means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
3 O8 C% L5 ], a1 F; WBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
9 r5 c1 H" D' U# R. r. mtherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

+ @2 w2 L! {- U( K+ @. y+ W# `3 E9 [! k) e: w0 B

+ S- ^0 i0 H6 p' `; w& @2 pA->B->C->D->E
; B9 l* _( C! w) V0 v, Dso does it mean if E failed to pay D,
& V  B' d# q. C# ^& a  Yall the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?. @) t; m0 P0 |1 z% `5 d2 W/ d

4 N7 F% ^" K" l2 Z& \" f' |# J* r  q8 {% p, ~- y
the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy, $ d! C. Q- |. a4 ]' `3 ?( L
in this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
1 d/ n, {# I, I$ ^" u+ {/ Uit's the problem of the debt itself.
; {% s/ w- x5 W; M+ tthe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
2 s( p& v0 H* @& @小弟一直都唔明...
, f; S' U0 F% d8 [$ ]1 h  s9 I9 N8 z% N, @& v
全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?
3 e6 O5 t6 u. i7 V, V% [% ?+ J: Z0 J4 U2 |6 w- w+ K
無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...4 u! e  f; ]8 Z1 _; O

9 `# a, J) a8 i1 j2 q1 \敬請各師兄解答" ?2 R; H" Y' V0 {* C7 u' }

5 W$ U. f3 J3 t; M& L% M2 vThanks

& A7 Z. N* K; Z
那些根本係 紙上財富  
+ U* Y" H3 u  h& |: J各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic
# m% S% @1 a: r7 H, t
: r. g  _2 a; c& a" ~http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
3 o/ {8 n' U; D/ f當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高" }- O' ]; |5 t# O$ J0 A
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
! Y1 W- o, c( Q4 M個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦7 I% M" @, }+ _' i3 `
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,* r) c) j3 h. ^  G7 \- p
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
3 r: J: A7 L8 T2 R6 k3 E前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法4 C" T" {% B, F
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得' R9 N& R& S+ ?+ g: S/ }; f9 d
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
. r$ Q; V2 p- }例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 8 u4 J( N: {& J7 P0 u) R1 ^
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
" r! U; J/ @* @" d- P" x/ t4 s所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
) }( _7 R( {8 H  k; V$ E5 k+ q; n& u" V: z
你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, , p. \# l2 L1 ^8 h: C, K) B, r1 v
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
6 s3 b- F0 A) B& @6 O淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ' V2 H# s& O# [: a; o; a; k/ Y
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
1 D3 |" g) a( Z咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif4 `8 y9 f8 c& E" h: F( l+ T+ a
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, + Q; x& A) Y( \3 Z
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
, ?& s" U8 Q) {/ P' g1 i( e" |呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行3 I) c" \: U/ \: S' c
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

/ n1 r; l, I* c6 y
: v3 Z8 a4 o( ?7 B  g: R
正係咁樣
" a, s& k! }$ f# M0 U" W其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業2 ^/ y: ]$ @# n
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢3 W; ~( ~/ v# j( @0 z. o
* c6 d2 s, U4 h
再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,  o4 I5 [+ Z4 H& n
連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票7 n5 `) ]* O( y/ r3 R: ^. m
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
& p6 H# P0 L  S# K+ \" z5 X8 Y  K  W" k3 p編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif- H" Y6 e% x- R. b1 q& w
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

: v" l9 V% v* }+ u; I
/ N9 A" `7 ?3 t% _5 j+ u3 k
其實係...$ {7 p# F' B/ g0 P' y
因為以前未生產, 先消費+ Z3 P8 E0 u$ A4 t- W
而家就要多生產, 少消費