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原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
  e( o( [( W$ C4 e. d' yWhy bank will sell 借據給第三者???0 L4 s) h# h. x5 e6 ?
I was so confused.....
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. u- n( [" z4 v& D6 y4 H. T講到尾都係賺錢5 v4 }% ?0 H; W5 S' o
so銀行可以不斷放款
% s2 n0 a" p- L- i( g+ R, l) C美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
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/ c0 M3 Q) T$ ?0 y. |mortgage loan
' R/ v2 B# ?: K! v  g! [0 i8 ^9 i>conduit* i8 m$ U* I2 X( j) o
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
# _- L6 K9 A" l# P6 E0 `>arranger
! R, K1 S1 I7 D5 d" F6 N2 S1 Z>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)
- R4 m* C$ A4 [3 q. c最後去到投資者
i thought it is the reason of rate of return.
) L2 n& c. o( z+ @- bCDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,9 \: b7 T6 R& U5 Y# q
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.$ |& X% m5 O$ z+ s- }$ T3 r
main reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,7 m" B: r7 S1 V* ]
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
7 m+ m7 I- V. j. n9 s6 I/ j+ Q1 k$ G5 nAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.6 J( W  R6 O* L. ]. Z& t
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
# P; r$ R! G1 W- y* G7 |normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. # c$ e2 O8 k& C- c. _
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. ( m6 |) I# E0 q# j  ?
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.9 a9 _1 \; _9 s2 p! o4 b
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.% v+ Q7 l& W- S7 W8 W  J
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,2 @7 Q% T# q( q& |1 y  L% S" {5 p
A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.+ D0 t6 s; j3 h" {) q4 B
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. + V- i, {2 h1 M1 |, K. I
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.) a' |9 y9 e) R' Z) {6 ?

: z. f, z" ^( u3 B& O5 m! N[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]
原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif# z1 y3 A$ X6 F$ S
Refer to last example,
, v0 v, U0 Y( Wthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
+ J( I" \0 {5 w9 I9 @4 W: KBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand 2 w# ?" ?% I. D
therefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...
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; I  A2 W3 Q6 J$ HA->B->C->D->E* s; H. ?8 {/ a8 r& r- Q, G
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, . a4 v5 s& F. Y" D0 [( j
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?% A- u& x0 C  _3 n: j) p- Q) K

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the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
, U) P7 Z5 i/ a( {% Ain this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, & H) u9 h7 g/ w. ^' N/ m2 Z# N
it's the problem of the debt itself.
4 t! \' N/ k9 Dthe debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.
原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif3 i* ^# |0 X6 ~5 n7 ?9 `
小弟一直都唔明...8 V: b( h& l9 |/ Y5 g
4 O; I8 j: ~$ C, F* Y8 D  o- R
全世界都蝕錢,咁邊個賺緊錢呢?( ]# u) X! y2 r5 d6 e

+ }& @2 n+ G' V3 e7 T- j, g) ^6 ?無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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敬請各師兄解答8 w" X9 S' t, _) v: [7 g# h

2 L% T2 Y) r. q- C9 u2 Q' VThanks
9 l, u, s9 f$ ^% Q: \& D- }4 }那些根本係 紙上財富  
' x6 m: d5 H, C' V9 I各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在
with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic8 e+ x1 M7 h& p7 Q" x
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http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif
其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產1 G& q4 V* T" d1 D" u1 J2 C
當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高: G" N* \; H" D; J& K$ Z! C1 U/ e
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊
4 w+ K* A- t, z+ h: K. N個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦5 W* r* T# g* ~
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,1 e7 m/ I5 q1 y2 l9 s- y1 e& e
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
6 s7 H; \. o' K' I# `3 s) P$ P- A& B前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
. h% Z; b' ^6 D; e/ s, d2 D' }同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
& Z8 j6 J8 H8 y但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺! ~; g; V% Y& T( b) K7 d+ z
例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 7 i4 E$ l$ `5 M3 w* J9 t
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
: m5 J4 G. z  i1 q7 ~5 U所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁
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3 ?) r( W2 O/ R, R. i1 C5 |你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
- b8 J% e0 Y# {5 K但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 6 ~$ E9 a' Q2 W' A0 ]0 C7 B
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
& Q, D) x: o" a  C4 I/ D8 @$ L呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
! G& b, P6 _. j& n/ G: R6 A咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?
原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif# r" P7 u/ x0 v* e$ x9 I6 [5 h
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, 5 j' ]- z# i# M/ j" Y
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, / i8 R7 A  o6 H7 O& k/ i
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行# i6 \  v+ D* U6 G, A2 C- ^. Y! q
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...
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正係咁樣7 S6 k7 Z; ^0 M4 x
其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業
4 p* d3 X" o  G0 c% e3 \; b分分鐘佢地唔使還錢4 H, o1 A5 Z; t9 a; c9 F! \$ ]
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再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
' K' f. D$ c! Q! E+ j; p連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
: L7 V( d" R% ^0 r一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
' }0 V% d( M8 S編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif( Y3 j6 x4 X6 {7 S
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
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其實係...
$ v6 h8 a9 q0 s0 ^5 k3 S因為以前未生產, 先消費6 V& Y/ S' D( r% w% g
而家就要多生產, 少消費
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