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原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif' X4 F4 `) |& R% A
Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???4 o' h- j" }& {; i
I was so confused.....
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! I  b* a4 p7 ^! C( i7 a& B講到尾都係賺錢
: G% p- }3 H, N: x( {1 Wso銀行可以不斷放款$ ~( N2 G& B/ A
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界' J7 M" E5 P/ Q5 m" b

% `5 X* i  P  nmortgage loan
5 y: a9 d3 z. T, f- Z+ D>conduit$ r2 ~- P4 d& g8 F9 S% o/ F: `
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)5 m1 O1 c" _) u8 i# t
>arranger
, ]9 n$ Y; O/ u# q' T& s4 U6 o4 o>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)2 j& o- P6 o% H1 W
最後去到投資者
i thought it is the reason of rate of return.* `. V8 S# @; e/ s* X
CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,: B" [' P) X1 V6 s" d7 o
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
- {1 p% g0 ]0 s7 S3 Q$ bmain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return,
6 _, F4 h* i' \: N6 xin other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.1 Q4 H" ~: @7 h! ~9 H& T" L
Also, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.
! L1 _* K! \# i. G8 @( Vsimilar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,# Y/ w  R! l) F, y6 B
normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. 9 @% j: A5 I" [6 n! D% s) A: D
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future. ( Z7 o" {( u' z
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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! X4 l4 w! A8 _im not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.' ]5 R: I. {/ ^" \# X) t. C
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.
9 w0 @. T. z7 G2 m1 y. f- {4 K' ~% C5 g( nFor eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
9 S( Z0 A8 b7 t, E; a0 [) P1 ]' \A's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction.
2 V( q. s* {3 D' r+ B- b  w& HThe capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities.
; a5 F/ X  z/ v, Y8 Nbut the value of their assets did really drop significantly.
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7 Y% b4 k# o2 @6 }" l3 Z[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]
原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif# W9 E( @2 [% s( g
Refer to last example,
5 J2 {+ X$ |. E& sthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
8 V4 V4 e; |) v. C6 l  K; X5 h* o) b2 ~Because bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
4 f% O% S+ Y0 Z0 F% G  p  h" utherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...
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  O$ @) J0 \3 u' AA->B->C->D->E5 R- d, B3 S" {2 q0 m
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, : a  H' m( H7 b* V! q; P- Q
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?0 u8 J! l$ Z% I7 C8 H' L/ ~
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; S- T5 g/ d8 {' rthe multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
% g2 ?8 \) @9 W6 J" t' H- yin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created, % C6 H) @) j# L3 ]
it's the problem of the debt itself.' R8 p  s! f. u( q
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.
原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif+ d) R% e1 _, a6 F% ^) t& X: B
小弟一直都唔明...
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1 E& t9 L% ^! H/ l2 z1 R全世界都蝕錢,咁邊個賺緊錢呢?% A5 B! U# S0 Y  z9 c9 R' ]% F
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無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...3 E( v6 L! C  ]. V, ^
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敬請各師兄解答
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6 \4 z; j9 f3 c9 `1 eThanks
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那些根本係 紙上財富  . M4 Y& `7 L' Z4 \
各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在
with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic  C1 c* v) I3 X
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http://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif
其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
) K& F2 h1 ]+ L; L. Y當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高7 i9 c" D7 ~7 M! W
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊6 H6 ?) Y  ~2 G( Q
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦
/ t" [  [; B" \1 r! W* z& e: J扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,, r+ P( {1 ^4 L2 e. m
計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
. w3 s, T6 {2 B( q5 `7 S2 A* ]前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法
7 E# c* y( F6 r' C2 j( U同埋個市場既前境要係好先得
/ M* }3 h# J% _" h但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺
9 }" m4 D. k7 _+ K( q" ?' R; f例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 6 H. k* |8 ?" [$ i! r; O
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%2 u3 u2 x5 B+ R$ c/ x7 W
所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁* A! W2 ~4 H( O$ z

, o+ f: f0 p- X# J" v2 J5 }% T你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值,
/ u% }( y2 O4 C: K但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~
唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
( E0 {' _4 M6 j/ C$ S: z, N淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, 0 ]+ `( l4 m4 H, l6 R# \% k
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行
5 q: M' g  T5 B3 N( ~. p' j咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?
原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
+ [8 {* _3 K, ~' ^6 R唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
: |/ l9 G2 Z& i0 h# P) b" `4 O淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒,
, I( d# u( G4 H  [/ Y, k& M呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行8 O4 h  E, X1 [: B3 @% |( n( B
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...
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, y# s* o  p: G正係咁樣
5 J3 n3 G% b* O; P4 F( Y4 q6 g其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業$ X- m7 L" G5 x7 z! F$ n
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢
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2 f1 _- t3 [$ ^! X- _再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
! O1 r' _/ @4 ?0 p" \+ H( z/ j% U5 J連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票
' p$ G6 r; M; `( o. K2 r! k' _一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產
% }2 X- x7 d/ U- c; _* t編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
" g1 ?( w" g  y咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???
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其實係...
; K; L3 e& {- F. e) m# U因為以前未生產, 先消費- ]3 z+ n8 k' Q' w- i$ ?
而家就要多生產, 少消費
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