0000001

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 05:56 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
7 ~; P9 |8 ~* R5 [  }Why bank will sell 借據給第三者???# R- G4 h+ F! `7 c, c9 h2 C  N( @
I was so confused.....

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. `( H/ E! z9 p! y- E講到尾都係賺錢
2 M! m: K' [0 X$ p* e2 zso銀行可以不斷放款- t! q$ P. E0 d5 f5 D! T
美國的房貸問題散佈到全世界
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mortgage loan , K, }: M( W9 o+ a2 \# I9 f
>conduit# ^* V6 H7 a7 u" W- r/ O" t
>RMBS(Residential Mortgage Backed Securities)
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5 |8 Z! ~) m" r9 `>CDO(Collateralized Debt Obligation)# L5 Z* g% o+ X5 D" W' G: C5 U4 [
最後去到投資者

Kev

i thought it is the reason of rate of return.
9 ~1 b+ u  g- y) g, ]CDs could have different ratings, AAA -> F,7 ?: M5 |7 D" y- Q
more risky ones would have higher premium (interest rate) as a compensation for an investment.
5 g6 N7 P: `( hmain reason why ppl buy those risky CDs is because the rate of return exceeds their internal rate of return," m" \3 q, u$ ~6 b: C
in other words, the interest rate of that investment > their required interest rate, therefore they invest in those securities.
  V& i8 V/ I7 L& I4 R4 |. X- QAlso, fund managers would include risky assets in their portfolio for different purposes, eg efficiency.. f2 J4 s+ a0 {. h& `  n
similar to bonds, CDs trading in the secondary market have different value at different times,
, P/ m! M6 L$ {3 Z3 `0 Y, Q$ G9 }2 _normally the value is calculated by adding it's principle and interest. : ^( l3 F2 J; z9 W: ]
eg. the value of the mortgage+the interests to be recieved in the future.   E0 O" H( e. z0 g
banks who sell the CDs, could enjoy a few benefits like, the present value of cash and passing the risk of holding a debt to another party.
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! E2 E8 [5 p' _* U7 {! wim not quite sure if the multiplier effect does really matter in this case.( \: A7 T8 Q* D! p# Q1 |$ X" ?
in stock market, it's the demand and supply pushing the price up/downwards.' i* B% P- W% F2 z
For eg, A bought 10000 shares @10$ ; B sells 20000 shares to C @ $12,
' X6 p. O7 v0 q# p! U  gA's shares would suddenly increase to $120000 from $100000 which does not invlove any $ transaction./ R) A7 H- j7 e0 u- e% ~
The capital loss that ppl suffer nowadays, i believe, most of them does not really suffer a real $ lost yet as long as they dont sell their securities. : ~; [5 M4 [( O/ e' e# w$ @- r6 r
but the value of their assets did really drop significantly.4 Y4 M7 ?; z& q8 r, W0 r* F
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[ 本帖最後由 Kev 於 2008-10-8 07:26 PM 編輯 ]

Kev

原帖由 balachiDavis 於 2008-10-8 04:09 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
: K  ^0 q2 \% [* L" W0 ?5 A9 g9 L! J: `4 aRefer to last example,
' |; t& n) S# w% ?5 Tthat means bank A have no money because we borrow 10 dollars from bank A
, g6 j$ j5 r+ F: c2 jBecause bank A doesnt have enough cash on hand
& _' R6 G6 r: M- w9 ?9 Ntherefore bank A need to be bankrrupt ??? Am I right ?? ...

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! O% c. Z5 U/ N- ^' }A->B->C->D->E; Y! L" N) i2 H. |1 x9 j/ U
so does it mean if E failed to pay D, " q+ D. g/ M1 y% ~0 A: a' @
all the B,C,D,E have to go bankrupt?
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the multiplier just tell how much money created in a whole economy,
+ \3 ^' F" M& K. _5 T1 Bin this case it doesnt really matter how much money is created,
" P) K' W- y. @it's the problem of the debt itself.5 O+ a5 i; q0 ^
the debt(securities) is bad, faulty, that harmed the whole system.

benny1219

原帖由 kerr12ca 於 2008-10-8 02:44 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif5 `  S# g  p. [9 m
小弟一直都唔明...
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* k! u) z+ i* S5 c% O全世界都蝕錢，咁邊個賺緊錢呢?7 M9 U3 Q- J! [. H: x6 r+ r

/ N% k# L! N9 r9 r8 e$ C無可能淨係有人蝕錢無人賺架嘛...
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, H6 D2 [4 B% q9 B+ W3 `敬請各師兄解答- M5 @2 D; H' m: C

7 M7 {0 N* X& a/ QThanks

* a7 A0 L1 ^; _% E+ K9 d那些根本係 紙上財富  2 i7 F" l9 B! I
各式各樣的證券被炒到上天 你一樣唔賣那筆錢永遠都不是真的存在

qulapo

with regards to the current crisis, Chain of fools does a reasonable job of explaining what happened with a nice graphic/ W  C6 L+ U5 D8 K  }

% D" a, |7 w# T6 r0 N, w2 ghttp://www.thedeal.com/newsweekly/images/100608_NWleverageFloChrt.gif

fderek

其實個D錢係你可以當係虛擬資產
+ o7 s) b9 E' J+ ]9 h當經濟好,投資銀行相信會賺錢, 物價既估值相對較高& K1 k8 W4 ]. P1 D4 `
於是投資銀行就去搵銀行抵押借錢投資, 打個比喻1蚊既野借10蚊5 {# i9 _4 L) {0 `8 d) o
個件物價係市場好既時候升, 例如15%先算,變左12蚊啦& T3 ~' q9 \6 P& w, z! a
扣番利息當10里, 咁公司都可以賺左11.5-10(1.1)=0.5蚊,
1 E- ]' W5 B% N+ L) l/ e$ d計番回報率就已經係50%,所以可以好好賺
& R3 g4 w9 N% l- {8 O0 ]前提係銀行之間要互相信任先可以咁樣借法- E* f5 @* A' r  N- t3 ~
同埋個市場既前境要係好先得+ f7 d& F- n2 t: ], o
但當經濟一差,公司估值趺了,物價不升反趺) X, g; R+ F# U
例如剛才說10蚊的, 趺到得番9蚊, 6 b* }% _( ]8 x- }+ b, i' h" x
咁投資銀行一下子就要還11蚊, 一來一回變左虧200%
3 Y/ s3 b, w. `: V1 Q, [" J# w所以你就會覺得D錢好似蒸發哂咁' A* P+ U" c( }" X9 d
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你都可以當標野咁諗, 個樣野多人可以狂升值, 0 i+ }9 D/ @" \# \
但當冇人要既時候一蚊都唔值...中間D錢其實真係冇人話賺左~

kuru

唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢,
/ Y. o) M2 n& b4 Y( [淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ( x  D, j: W8 ]. Y) u  Q
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行5 }6 F: F+ T) m) r4 L
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊?

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 kuru 於 2008-10-12 05:08 PM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif
% y/ ~% f! h, g唔係d錢蒸發, 而係比美國佬洗晒未來錢, # Q# n) b% V, V3 s- i# X' \- c8 T
淨如你簽左卡, 呢刻爆卡,咁d去晒邊?咪之錢用晒, ' o/ K( T5 [; V: v
呢刻樓市爆, 原本冇錢買樓既, 又係問銀行借但又唔留錢供, 既然冇錢還比銀行- h! o6 E( n* P( t( b; I
咁你話d錢蒸發左去邊? ...

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正係咁樣
! J2 V( @) Y8 p其實, 以個人立場去睇, 美國好多市民都唔怕銀行/財務/投資公司結業" z, C, R' [& w0 a
分分鐘佢地唔使還錢: |5 P: R. q: ^4 G: B

! [) y4 c- @- _2 o7 S  V再講, 美國人先洗未來錢應該係世界第一, 唔知點解無錢都可以買咁車買樓,
4 d0 J9 |2 L5 Z$ x5 U" X- Z連國家都係問人借, 不停發債券, 印鈔票9 X. V7 y2 n+ {, t1 x5 @% ^
一個國家好少出口, 而又大量入口 ,反映到佢唔多生產" ?" _8 n, S! X3 |& f
編編唔生產又使用物品使用得最多, 美國就係咁既情況

Jk

咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

fcukyoukelly

原帖由 Jk 於 2008-10-22 02:15 AM 發表 http://www.26fun.com/bbs/images/common/back.gif/ Q" h, k8 Q( y( f& f; I
咁而家"爆哂煲"算唔算先至係變番"正常"???

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/ q+ m8 U$ {) x, o1 j3 V2 U; I其實係...2 B2 z) a& i. @9 ?" I8 _
因為以前未生產, 先消費  h9 c! d% ^7 A+ Q2 L
而家就要多生產, 少消費